(1977 CJ5) I have been reading all the previous posts regarding 'wandering'. My steering gear box is leaking fluid so i know it needs rebuilt or at least new seals. I have a very slight tie rod slip. Replacing which of these two should give me more results? I will do both but which one is going to do the most good to correct the 'wandering'?Also have a question about lift. It appears I have stock leaf springs. I don't really want it any higher of the ground. Running 33x12.50s. What is the smallest amount of lift that I can run the same wheel and tire package? Should I switch to coil springs? Are coils even possible? Will any of this help correct the steering issues?Thanks,Jerms
steering issues...& lift question...
- Thread starter jerms14
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69jeepcj
New member
The steering box leaking fluid will not cause wandering, if the box is a cause of wandering it is because of worn parts inside the box. The tie rod end would be the first thing that I would replace. Make sure that your shackle bolts are tight and not have loosend, the way I do this is to jack up each cornor of the jeep and slightly tighten the shackle bolts, if they are loose snug em up. while the tire is off the ground cheeck for bad wheel bearing in the front, grab the tire at 12 and 6 oclock and try to push and pull on the tire, then do 3 and 9 oclock, if there is movement you probably need a new wheel bearing. With the jeep on the ground you can bounce up and down on your bumper and the schackle should swing some, if they dont you tightened them too much. check your axle spring plates (the plates your springs are attached to the axle with) and make sure those bolts are tight. make sure your steering gear box is bolted tight to the frame. There is also a rebuildable joint at the bottom of your steering shaft where it attaches to the steering box that gos bad often, to check, grab your steering shaft down low and push pull wiggle and again if there is any slop it replace it. these are known areas for wandering on cjs, other than having alignment done. good luck and keep us posted.
With the jeep on the ground you can bounce up and down on your bumper and the schackle should swing some, if they dont you tightened them too much
Read more: http://www.jeepz.com/forum/cj-yj-tj-jk/41150-steering-issues-lift-question.html#ixzz2E2Qz0D6FShould you actually see the front shackles pivot on the bolts while bouncing the jeep up and down?
Read more: http://www.jeepz.com/forum/cj-yj-tj-jk/41150-steering-issues-lift-question.html#ixzz2E2Qz0D6FShould you actually see the front shackles pivot on the bolts while bouncing the jeep up and down?
JPNinPA
Well-known member
Most wandering will come from loose and worn parts. Next check the alignment. Specifically toe. Too little toe will cause wandering.
Not sure on your steering box but some have adjustments for slop. But verify it is the box. Also check your steering column joints if you have them. If they are worn you likely need new, ash there is no rebuild made for even newer jeeps.
Somewhere else I saw a broken frame cause some steering issues on leaf spring vehicles. They ended up welding and adding a steering box brace.
P.S. nice link Chuck
:funny:
Not sure on your steering box but some have adjustments for slop. But verify it is the box. Also check your steering column joints if you have them. If they are worn you likely need new, ash there is no rebuild made for even newer jeeps.
Somewhere else I saw a broken frame cause some steering issues on leaf spring vehicles. They ended up welding and adding a steering box brace.
P.S. nice link Chuck
:funny:
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69jeepcj
New member
Yes there is rebuild kit for the cj steering shaft but only the lower joint, I have installed many, but not the upper which is a actual ujoint, the lower isnt actually a ujoint but sorta similar. at the upper end of the shaft there is a bearing that is replacable where it gos into the actual column. There is no rebuild kit for the newer jeeps because they are a better design, they have actual ujoints at both ends of the steering shaft, cj,s did not. Yes you should see the shackles pivot on the bolts, but not a ton of movement, as long as they move some though. This allow your susenpion to move up and down as you are driving or offroading, if the bolts loosen too much the jeep will wander, if too tight they will not allow suspension movement and the ride will be harsh. A steering box brace was mentioned above. They are great, I would get one if you dont have one already. I think every jeep should have a steering box brace, it helpa out alot.
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frhrwa
New member
along with tightening, check the bushings, if they are worn, it will wonder like crazy.. have someone turn the steering wheel back and forth a little bit, engine off.. watch the shackles and steering box, along with the tie rods.. if the steering box moves, get the heavy duty mount, if the shackles move, replace the bushings and tighten good.. if the tie rods are a problem, it will be evident.. also how much play is in your column?
TrailRatedRN
New member
I think it is a very educational link. :lol:P.S. nice link Chuck
I got these big long shackles on the front and back. Bushings are completely worn and shackles do not move when 250 lbs of man jump on the bumper. Im guessing these shackles could be at least part of my problem, huh?
Good news is, my tie rods came in today. Bad news is, family Christmass getaaway this weekend so the earliest I can work on 'Luke the Drifter' again is Sunday night. Thanks for all the info and someone please let me know about these long shackles....
69jeepcj
New member
WOW, Those shackles are at least one of your problems, I gaurantee it! Too long. Get shorter shackles and your steering WILL improve, your can go up to 2" longer than stock (not 2" lift) shackle without problems, any longer and issues arrise. What happens is the longer shackles lift (atually lower) the jeep at only one end of the spring, which tilts your axle and changes the steering geometry due to the the change in the tilt. the longer the shackle the worse this is. (very simplified explanation) If you replace tie rods and rebuild the lower joint on the steering shaft, your problem will improve but still be there. Its the shackles causeing most of the issue. The 2" longer shackles will give you 1" of lift from them.
I have 33x12.50s on my Jeep. If I return to stock shackles, I don't think I can run this wheel package. Therefore, I have been looking at lift kits. I read on this forum somewhere that a 2 1/2" lift I could run 33s. But when I went to order, JCW claims 4" for 33s. Who is right, from experience please?UPDATE: Pickle Fork required for changing tie rods. And by the way, this is my first time working on a vehicle let alone a Jeep. I learn a lot from this forum and your guys' opinions. Thanks y'all...
PoliceMonkey161
New member
It's really going to come down to how much back spacing your rims have with a 12.50" tire. I had 33X12.50's with a 2.5" spring lift and 1" lifted shackles, I still had plenty of room.
Try researching "back spacing" to get a better idea of how this effects your ride and total lift needed.
Try researching "back spacing" to get a better idea of how this effects your ride and total lift needed.
69jeepcj
New member
You can run 33,s with 2 1/2 lift. my brother installed the kit on his cj. If you have 33 x 12.50 you should be running a 10" (width) rim, the back spacing on the 8" rim isnt right and you will probably have problems on 76-81 narrow track axles. with the 10" rim and 2 1/2" lift the tires may rub a little (very little) on your fender flares when the suspension is really flexed out but that was about it. He liked the low center of gravity when wheeling compared to taller lifts.
frhrwa
New member
get rid of the big long shackles, get rid of the rubber bushings, get some hard bushings, not sure what they're made of, but they are black and hard, no flex.. i had wandering so bad, couldn't stay off the sidewalks.. just kept nibbling away until it got to just mild wandering.. changed out those stock soft rubber bushings and now she steers like a new jeep..
Well I guess I should have started somewhere else in correcting the wandering. I changed tie rods and ends, lower steering shaft, steering bearing, wheel bearings, and brakes. Steering is much tighter but still wanders. Dang shackles still got me. Real lift kit next I suppose....instrad of this crappy shackle lift...
69jeepcj
New member
Yeah, shackles were never intended to be used as a acutal lift per say.. they give you that little extra clearance that you may need to avoid some rubbing after installing a lift and larger tires. Over the years though they just keep getting longer and longer. If you are going to get a lift any way, you will have to replace the shackles anyway. I would start by buying smaller shackles, keep them close to stock, I think stock is around 4-4 1/2" so I wouldnt go longer than 5-5 1/2", stock would be best..and see if that fixes the problem. You should be able to drive on the street with you 33,s on stock shackles, its off road that rubbing becomes a problem with the suspension flexing.
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